Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: All right, Don, I have four things on the table, and I'm going to see if you can connect them to Christ. I'll hold them up and then tell me how they connect to Christ. Here we go. I'm going to go easy on you.
[00:00:09] Speaker B: Oh, thank you. So he's the waters of life.
[00:00:11] Speaker A: Nice. Okay.
[00:00:13] Speaker B: He's the rock of our foundation.
He was pierced with a nail. Is that it?
[00:00:20] Speaker A: Yes. Nice. And a pencil.
[00:00:23] Speaker B: He's the law. He's the word.
[00:00:25] Speaker A: That's a good connection.
[00:00:26] Speaker B: He's the word of God.
[00:00:27] Speaker A: Love that.
[00:00:28] Speaker B: Help me out.
[00:00:28] Speaker A: No, you're. Well, that is good. I wasn't even thinking of that.
[00:00:31] Speaker B: What's the pencil?
[00:00:32] Speaker A: Well, you're totally correct. And there's another fun answer. So I did this with my students. I put this verse of scripture we're gonna talk about to the test. I'm gonna tell you what that verse of Scripture is, and I'm gonna tell you what this pencil had to do with my student.
[00:00:44] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:00:45] Speaker A: Welcome to Jesus Christ in Finding Christ on Every Page. I'm Tammy Usalak hall with my friend, Dr. Donald W. Perry. Grab your scriptures and let's turn to Moses, chapter six. And we want to look at verse 63. And that's the only verse we're studying. You love studying one verse at a time, right?
[00:00:59] Speaker B: Oh, I love it. I love doing a very close examination of the text. Yeah, it's just. It's so powerful.
[00:01:05] Speaker A: It's really fun to do. And so we're gonna do just one verse right now. Make sure you have something to mark your scriptures with. We're gonna mark this verse up. But there's something important about this verse, because at the very end of the verse, it says, all things bear record of me. And I had all my seminary students, and we were learning this verse, and I said, all right, let's put it to the test. I give you a couple minutes. I'm. I want you to go outside and come back in and bring something that reminds you of Christ. And so kids went and found obvious things. I had a young boy, and he sat in the room. He did not leave. So I felt like, well, he's probably just not even going to participate. This kid's a punk. Everybody had to get up and they had to share what they found. And it was his turn. And he came up and he was like a pencil. And I'm like, here we go. And I said, okay. How is a pencil bearing record of Christ? And he goes, because it points upward, it points to Christ.
And I was like, Hands with the assignment.
[00:01:52] Speaker B: I love it.
[00:01:53] Speaker A: He got it. I like yours, though. It is how you write the law. That is such a great connection, too. So this is a fun assignment to do if you're teaching this. If you have kids and you can go outside, have them find things that bear record of him. But let's find out some contextual evidence about how things really do and what verse 63 has to teach us about Christ. All right, let's dig into this verse.
[00:02:12] Speaker B: So let me just explain this verse. I. I did a computer count twice. There's 67 words.
[00:02:18] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:02:18] Speaker B: And I'm calling them pivotal. They pertain to Christ. They're unique in all scripture.
They're highly significant because it affirms that all things bear record of Jesus Christ. Now, I've had some people in my life ask if the book of Moses is the word of God. Members of other faiths perhaps. What's the Book of Moses? What is that? The book of Moses in the pearl of great price.
My solemn opinion is if they read Moses 6, 63 carefully and thoughtfully, they'll know the entire book is true. Yeah. Now, I want to bear my witness.
The Book of Moses is indeed the word of God, and it's Jesus Christ focused. So we're going to look at it closely. And Enoch spake forth the word of God. The people trembled and could not stand in his presence. And then Enoch in his speech, cites God's words to Adam. And he says, and he called upon our father Adam by his own voice, saying, I am God. God also said unto Adam, and the Lord said unto Adam, and the Lord spake unto Adam, saying, so he keeps us on track. Okay. I'm still citing God's words to Adam. So the greater context, these are found in the Book of Moses. So did Moses have an Enoch plate or scroll?
And then the book of Moses was translated in the latter days by the prophet and Sarah, Joseph. I mean, how powerful?
[00:03:45] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. And your testimony shored up my testimony about the Book of Moses when you said, it's Jesus Christ focused.
[00:03:52] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:03:53] Speaker A: Because oftentimes people have issues with this about how we got the Book of Moses and Joseph Smith. And the most important thing when you said, it's Jesus Christ focused, is that the book of Moses was translated by Joseph Smith. It's Jesus Christ focused on full stop.
[00:04:05] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:04:06] Speaker A: Therefore, for me, it's the word of God.
[00:04:08] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:04:08] Speaker A: Love it.
[00:04:08] Speaker B: Okay, this is for everyone out there. Would you trade knowledge of Moses663, the passage at hand, for gold, silver, or precious gems? How about the giga pearl below left, we think it's about 50 carats, and it sold in 2011 for 11 million. How about the gold piece on the right or the silver on the bottom? Would you rationalize and say, yes, I would trade knowledge of 663 for any of those things? Because then I could pay tithing on them, I could sell them.
[00:04:37] Speaker A: I'm thinking it could get me out of a couple of jams or get you out jams.
[00:04:40] Speaker B: Or I'm supposed to get out of debt and I'd get out of debt.
[00:04:43] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:04:43] Speaker B: But I'm going to show you real helpful. No, no.
[00:04:46] Speaker A: We're going to answer no at the end.
[00:04:48] Speaker B: We're going to answer no at the end.
[00:04:48] Speaker A: Okay? And behold, all things have their likeness, and all things are created and made to bear record of me. Both things which are temporal and things which are spiritual. Things which are in heaven above and things which are on the earth, and things which are in the earth, and things which are under the earth, which both above and beneath. All things bear record of me.
[00:05:06] Speaker B: What we're going to do, Sister hall, is break this down into different components and look to see just how powerful this is and how many things actually bear record of the Lord. So what things are created that bears record of him? Heaven, earth, light, firmament, waters, dry land, vegetation, plants, fruit, fruit, trees and other trees, sun, moon, stars, sea creatures, animals, creeping things, beasts, woman, man, plus more. What can we unpack just in the passage? All things are created. Yeah.
[00:05:42] Speaker A: Then we have this, that all things have their likeness. All things are created and made to bear record of me. And then at the bottom, all things bear record of me.
So this is a figure of speech. And this is important because it start, we have bare record. Bare record. So it's acting like an envelope. Teach us about that.
[00:05:59] Speaker B: The figure is called enveloping. It has another term too, but I like enveloping and the fact that it's found toward the beginning, all things bear record to me. And toward the end, all things bear record to me. It's enclosing, but also emphasizing.
[00:06:15] Speaker A: And behold, all things have their likeness. All things are created and made to bear record of me. Then you have the word things so many times in this verse, I'm going to highlight that. I'm going to circle things. Tell us about this word, things.
[00:06:26] Speaker B: That's emphasizing the totality of things that bear record. Okay, this one, this one in the middle, it says both things which are temporal and things which are spiritual.
In my opinion. What's left? Temporal, spiritual. What Else is there? Nothing. This demonstrates, again, the totality of things that bear record of God.
[00:06:46] Speaker A: Then we have in here, we have in the heavens, above, on the earth, in the earth, under the earth. That was fun. Like I had circled on in under or something significant about that wording. Why do you want us to know this?
[00:06:58] Speaker B: Because the four phrases again demonstrate the completeness of things that bear record of God. So if you say, oh, what did he miss?
What's missing here? We're talking about heavens above, things on the earth, in the earth and under the earth. What else is there? It's covering everything. And all those things bear testimony.
All created things, all things enveloping the things repeated so many times.
Temporal and spiritual things, and then things in the heavens, earth, and so on. There's this wonderful quote that I found that. Oh, it's just so powerful.
[00:07:38] Speaker A: This is by Henry B. Eyring. When we contemplate the stunning vastness, it is wise to remember, behold, all things are created and made to bear record of me. It is a witnessing and overwhelming universe. Yeah, it is overwhelming.
[00:07:51] Speaker B: So he's citing the verse we're talking about?
[00:07:54] Speaker A: Yes, he is.
[00:07:54] Speaker B: And I love this idea. It's a witnessing universe. Back to our question. Would you trade knowledge of Moses 6, 63 for precious items? Now, I hope everyone said, no, I'd never trade it. I'd rather have that knowledge that all things testify of the Lord more than all the treasures. Now let's see what some scriptures say.
[00:08:13] Speaker A: Okay. This is found in the book of Job. Where shall wisdom be found? And where is the place of understanding? Man knoweth not the price thereof. It cannot be gotten for gold, Neither shall silver be weighed for the price thereof. It cannot be valued with gold of Ophir, with the precious onyx or the sapphire. The gold and the crystal cannot equal it. And the exchange of it shall not be for jewels of fine gold. No mention shall be made of coral or of pearls. For the price of wisdom is above rubies.
[00:08:41] Speaker B: Now, there's something hidden in the Hebrew that you would recognize. So when it says wisdom in Hebrew, as you know, nouns are either feminine or masculine. And wisdom, chuchma is feminine. So when it says, where will wisdom be found?
Man knoweth not her price. In the Hebrew say, her price, she wisdom, cannot be gotten for gold, and she cannot be valued with the gold of Ophir and so on. So I love the fact that he's going through, he mentions gold and then a really high value gold. He mentions onyx and sapphire, which is a Hebrew word, by the way. Sapir.
[00:09:23] Speaker A: Oh, neat.
[00:09:24] Speaker B: Yeah. I'm going for memory here. Golden crystal, fine gold, coral, pearls, rubies.
And he's saying wisdom's it.
[00:09:34] Speaker A: Yeah, wisdom's it.
[00:09:35] Speaker B: Wisdom and understanding.
[00:09:36] Speaker A: Can I share a cool scripture with us?
[00:09:38] Speaker B: Absolutely, yes. Yes.
[00:09:39] Speaker A: Wisdom being female in our Book of Mormon.
[00:09:41] Speaker B: This is cool.
[00:09:41] Speaker A: Okay, so it's in the Book of Mosiah. Oh, how marvelous are the works of the Lord. How long doth he suffer with his people? For they will not seek wisdom. Neither do they desire that she should rule over them.
[00:09:52] Speaker B: Oh, wow.
[00:09:54] Speaker A: Is that so fun?
[00:09:55] Speaker B: I love it. I know another Hebraism right there in the Book of Mormon. She.
[00:10:01] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:10:02] Speaker B: Oh, I love it.
[00:10:02] Speaker A: That's fun. I think this is totally fun.
[00:10:04] Speaker B: And I love the fact that wisdom is personified as a woman.
[00:10:08] Speaker A: Right.
[00:10:09] Speaker B: And that just really puts women right up there.
[00:10:12] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:10:12] Speaker B: And we have a proverbs that talks about this lady Wisdom. Yes. And so on. We may look at it depends on our time. We're still talking about gold and things that humans seek after. It means much to them. And they fight wars and they steal it, and they work hard for it.
Versus reading Moses 6, 63. Or any of the Scriptures.
[00:10:36] Speaker A: Peter. Forasmuch as ye know that ye are not redeemed with corruptible things as silver and gold.
[00:10:42] Speaker B: James. Your gold and silver is cankered, and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire.
Ye have heaped up treasure together for the last days.
[00:10:55] Speaker A: Peter. Then Peter said to the lame man, silver and gold have I none, but such as I have give I thee. In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, rise up and walk. And he took him by the right hand and lifted him up, and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength.
[00:11:11] Speaker B: Paul. I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things and do count them but dung that I may win Christ.
[00:11:27] Speaker A: And the 12 gates were 12 pearls. Every several gate was one pearl. And the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
[00:11:35] Speaker B: And my point of bringing this one up is some mortals work their lifetime to get gold and put it in their safety deposit boxes or wherever they put it and show it to their neighbors.
But to read Moses 6, 63 or any of the Scriptures, oh, these have eternal values. Just so our audience will know when we say all things testify of Christ, it's Moses 6, 63. I use that a lot in my everyday conversation. All things testify of me he says.
[00:12:11] Speaker A: And it's such a fun thing to do and to just actually work that into your everyday speech.
We do that in my family with sunsets.
[00:12:18] Speaker B: Oh, okay.
[00:12:19] Speaker A: Whenever we have a cool sunset in our family, we'll text each other, check out the sunset. And I always like to thank Heavenly Father, like, well done. That was beautiful. But to work in thanks for all of his creations. But I think the most important thing about studying this verse of Scripture that you've taught us is when all things, all things bear record of him that includes us. And then it makes me ask, like, am I doing that this week? How am I doing?
[00:12:41] Speaker B: Beautiful.
[00:12:41] Speaker A: And I feel like on Sundays when we partake of the sacrament, it's sort of a reset. Like, this week, I will bear record of Christ. And here's what I'm due to do, a little bit better at that.
[00:12:48] Speaker B: So, yeah, powerful. Thank you.
[00:12:50] Speaker A: Thank you for sharing that, Don. I love studying one verse at a time. We hope you enjoyed it, too. Have a great week bearing record of Christ. Shalom and goodbye.
